Dulwich Hill Bicycle Club

Hi All,

After the recent demise of my frame (cracked on Sunday), I'm keen to make the move to carbon with a budget of around $4k.

At the moment I'm tossing up between a Cervelo S2 ($3200 with Cheeky) with with Rival and a Pinarello FPQuattro with Ultegra ($4k Clarence St) (both with crappy wheels).

Any input will be handy. I've never ridden SRAM so it is foreign to me, but will save me some coin if it rides well. I also presume there are fans of both Cervelo and Pinarello. My aim is to start racing next year so race geometry is a must.

Cheers,

Noel

can't give you any technical advise. but i recon the Cervelo looks heaps nicer!

re the Pinny, I'd give George at Endeavour Cycles a call. I'm sure he'd do a better price than Clarence St. I got my Pinny (FP3 - which looks to have been replaced by the FPQuattro) there and also looked at the Cervelo. Ride was harsher on the Cervelo & not as comfortable but better racing geometry with stiffer frame - also lighter I'd wager. I like the look of the Pinny better, but it's all personal.

Thanks Stu. Will do.

But the main question: Rival or Ultegra?

Six of one vs half a dozen of the other I reckon. You should go and have some test rides and do some empirical comparisons, then come back and tell us what your conclusions are.

Thanks Stu. Will do.

But the main question: Rival or Ultegra?

Clarence St have a great range, but they are in the city so at times they can be expensive. Pinarello are my favourite so I am a bit biased. But Geoff Semon works on bikes every week as the mechanic at Steve Hoggs shop and he says he gets a lot of Cevelo's for cracks in the frame. I ride Sram Red and love it, I have also ridden Ultegra which is perfectly fine. If you were going with the Sram Red, I'd say do that, but i would go Ultegra over the Sram Force personally.

There is my 2 cents worth. good luck - always exciting getting a new bike. There are so many to choose from these days.

What groupset did you have your old bike?

Thanks Stu. Will do. But the main question: Rival or Ultegra?

I've only ever had Ultegra so can't do a comparison.

With $4k budget, I'd be thinking about building a bike from components. As you've already noted, cheap wheels are common on showroom bikes. You may be better off in getting a superior frame online and go from there.

I concur with Stuart. Call George at Endeavour cycles in Gymea. He has sold me two bikes and spent a considerable amount of time fitting them to me. He sells both Cervelo and Pinarello. With my recent purchase George walked me through Cervelo, Pinarello and Specialized. He then walked me through Dura Ace and Ultegra. Although I had an open mind I really didnt communicate much to him beyond my budget. He really hit the nail on the head though without me having to vocalise my ego driven, poor excuse for wanting a new bike, when you are a shabby ar#@ed cyclist, poor reasons.

I have Ultegra. He explained why I would be having Ultegra. I nodded. He explained why I would be having Ultegra pedals and not Dura Ace pedals. I nodded. I have a Specialized. He explained why I would be having a Specialized. I nodded. I have Mavic Wheels. He explained why I would be having Mavic Wheels. I nodded. It went on like that. At the end he said to me that if i then said to him that i want a different frame and setup HE would have nodded. But I have to say. He came in under budget with a frame, groupset, wheels and setup that makes me want to sing.

Can't help ya with Sram!

cheers

Dougie

What groupset did you have your old bike?

A mix.

105 - shifters
Ultegra - casette, RD
Dura Ace - FD (long story but i broke a few 105 FD)

got a few more $$ ? http://www.cyclingexpress.com/cycle/bmc ... white.aspx

or ask Amy about this one >> http://www.cyclingexpress.com/cycle/bmc ... naked.aspx

only till Friday .. I'd be tempted.

I have Mavic Wheels. He explained why I would be having Mavic Wheels. I nodded.

If he had explained Mavic's freehub bearing design, you may have swayed.

got a few more $$ ? http://www.cyclingexpress.com/cycle/bmc ... white.aspx

or ask Amy about this one >> http://www.cyclingexpress.com/cycle/bmc ... naked.aspx

only till Friday .. I'd be tempted.

I recently purchased the BMC Race Machine RM01 from Cycling Express in Melbourne per Stuarts link above. If you are interested give Sam a call he will be happy to help. The frame is race geometry with Sram Red and is simply awesome. I have only ridden it 4 times (3 to waterfall and 1 solo ride) and there is no comparison with my Giant Alloy bike with Shimano 105. Getting the power to the road is amazing and the responsiveness of the frame gives you so much confidence. The bike is great on hills which would suit your climbing abilities.

I can only compare 105 with Sram Red - which is an unfair comparison. Given what I know about Shimano and Sram I would agree with Karzie that either Rival or Ultegra are more than adequate. At the end of the day it is all about the overall package - frame and groupset. The BMC frame and Sram Red were made for one another and weigh a staggering 6.9kg.

As mentioned already check out the respective Cervelo and Pinarello packages to see which works best for you. In my humble opinion it is what works for you that counts not what others say or think. We all have different body shapes and riding styles which work better with different frames.

I think that the Rival weighs less than the Ultegra, although I could be completely off base (and I'm packing at the moment, so I'm not bothering to actually, you know, look it up). It is cheaper though, and I reckon its great. That said, the rear cluster is noisier in SRAM, so having worn out the chain and gotten a new set of wheels, both my chain and the rear cluster are now Shimano.

In summary, Rival is pretty good.

I'm having all the trouble in the world with my SRAM rival levers at the moment. I should say over the past year in fact. It's just that it's really only this weekend that I came out of denial, hit the wall (or - literally speaking - the top tube) and threatened to chuck by entire bike off a cliff. About 3 times. The left lever has been non-responsive for a while, so that it often takes 4 or 5 clicks to go from the big chain ring to the little one. By which time you're on the hill, out of the saddle, struggling up the incline with full body weight plus power driving through the cranks. Only then does the chain suddenly drop into the little ring ... you can imagine the results.

About 2 months ago the right lever went funny coming back from Waterfall. It ended up snapping off altogether! Metal fatigue by the looks of it. Steve hogg had put the bike together for me so Geoff took it into the shop for me and sent both levers down to SRAM. Some weeks later ... bike is back. Right lever fixed. Left lever still a nightmare. It was just out of warranty and they charged me for the repair anyway. But this is a bike that's only done about 10,000km, on a very generous estimate. And I'm pretty gentle with gears (because I usually forget to use them). And levers just shouldn't snap off like that!

Geoff's lending me some Ultegra he's got lying about (who doesn't?) so I can do the Alpine Classic. Love affair with SRAM is well over. There may even be divorce proceedings if they want to charge me for re-building the left lever again.

There may even be divorce proceedings if they want to charge me for re-building the left lever again.

Are SRAM brifters rebuildable? I thought only Campag brifters are.

You're right Weiyun. I think they replaced a bit. Not a re-build. the left lever i think they just didn't look at.

I understand that Campag's ErgoPower brifters are good for 10,000 to 15,000km before needing a rebuild ie. Replace a pair of G-springs. I further understand that Shimano brifters typically will last for 20,000km or more before failing, but it'll be a throw away job. Presume SRAM is similar.

Back to the Ultegra vs Rival question. Knowing they are both from reputable brands, shouldn't the decision be made through actual user preference? Take a ride and see how you like the feel of the brifter in your hands and the way shifting works. The decision will and should be subjective.

Brifter! I had thought at first it was a typo, but now I have a new word. verified by Google, so it must be true. Thanks Weiyun.

I suppose the thing with my SRAM is that I love the feel of them, and the way they work, but the brifters are just a bit shonky. And it's not that I'd done 10,000km before that happened. The rest of the group set I have no complaints about at all, but if a wealthy aunt pops out of the blue and asks me what I want for Xmas I'll be requesting Ultegra.

I appreciate your displeasure on the Rival. Failing at under 10k is most disappointing.

Wasn't Rival the introductory groupset for SRAM when they entered the market? Or was that Force? If so, then it could be one of those early production issue that can happen to all products. Not batting for SRAM but just curious if it's a poor batch or whether it's something that's persisting in the current production run.

I'd go ultegra, though what do your friends use? You can then borrow tools

I'd go for the ultegra also. Sram front derailleurs aren't as good as campag or shimano.
Campag are completely rebuildable where as shimano isn't. Shimano levers last a very long time.
As to wheels, i wouldn't touch mavic with a 10' barge pole. They are crap and if you ride the ones with alloy inserts and spokes which corrode if ridden in wet weather, good luck if the wheel ever needs truing.
Go and buy some good hubs (chris king, white industries.....) and some rims like velocity a23, mavic open pro or some american classic if want light weight and get a good wheel builder to put them togeter for you. If you must buy low spoke wheels have look at Fulcrum

Thanks all. I'm steering towards ultegra. Will be test riding a Focus Izalco Pro 3.0 with Sram Force on Thursday (weather permitting). Once I get a feel for how this shifts, I might have a better idea.

Also, now I've had a good look around i'm struggling on taking a stance on manufacturer. At the $4k mark there is a lot of good bikes to choose from. Saw a Cannondale SuperSix with Ultegra for $3600, a Bianchi Sempre with Ultegra for $3500. The list goes on.

I might have to go with the one that looks pretty...

I might have to go with the one that looks pretty...

I think you've found the ultimate decision maker! Congrats!

I've seen too many bianci's with cracked frames. Not recommended

Avanti Ultegra. Very pretty...

Finally got approval from my wife for the purchase. No doubt my birthday and chrissy present for the next year or so......

Bought a Giant TCR 0 with Ultegra Di2 from MC Cyclery. Fitting booked for next week so with any luck will be on it next Sunday.

MC in the city or marubra store?

City. Clarence St.

Ya, i'm about to buy one there. The guys are great, and you should totally come out for the hills ride on thursdays.
http://mccyclery.com.au/event/5-hills-ride/2012-04-26